Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots Screenshot

Metal Gear Solid 4 is nothing if not a difficult, frustrating, and absolutely strange experience. A vanguard in some ways but a throwback in most, this latest work fits Hideo Kojima's canon in that the final shape of the creation isn't quite what was expected, yet the shocking unevenness at its core sets it apart. Guns of the Patriots lacks the dynamic energy of the master at his craft so typical of his greatest works… Missing the mad genius, the bravado and boldness that has always defined a Kojima game, Guns of the Patriots is not the finale that Solid Snake deserves.

For an exclusive title that currently represents the primary reason to own a PlayStation 3, Metal Gear Solid 4's structural framework is surprisingly archaic underneath the absurdly refined sheen and stunning layers of graphical excellence. However, though the game looks leaps and bounds ahead of the competition (and it really does), it doesn't play that way.

In terms of game design, Guns of the Patriots is just like the last two Metal Gear games with little to differentiate them outside of small tweaks and a control scheme that finally feels comparable to the current standard. Though I didn't expect Kojima to reinvent the Metal Gear formula, what I did expect was an updating and revitalization of the "tactical espionage action" the game purports to deliver.

For example, Solid Snake is still constrained by artificial barriers that many other games of the current age have left behind. For a battle-scarred veteran with decades of experience, how is it that small boxes and low obstructions are completely insurmountable, guiding the player like a rat through a maze with a dubious level of believability? How is it that a rocket launcher still can't open a wooden door? With the amount of horsepower under the PS3's hood, why can't Solid Snake walk up mildly sloping hills and interact with his environment outside of specifically prescribed actions?

In another example of outdated design, a heated battle raged in a small compound. After being thrust into the middle of the conflict, my instinct was to take the fight to the enemy and eliminate all opposition.  I started with a stealthy approach and took out the peripheral guards before moving towards full-on assault screaming from behind a chaingun. Having the freedom to guide my own actions in this environment was a spectacular experience until I realized that the enemy army was infinitely respawning because I wasn't doing what Kojima wanted me to. In that moment, my level of immersion was completely destroyed. An endless stream of enemies because I didn't trip the right trigger? The game itself makes several references to being technologically advanced and leaving the limitations of the PS2 behind, but with design decisions like this, I fail to see what Kojima's talking about.

Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the  Patriots Screenshot

In what is perhaps the most offensive of all the outdated choices, Kojima devotes an unbelievably massive portion of the game's play time to non-interactive cutscenes.

Although I respect his creativity and craft as a director, the simple fact is that a videogame is not a film. Though the two mediums do share some of the same elements, many recent titles have proven that game storytelling is most successful when it capitalizes on the unique ability to involve players in ways film never could. Guns of the Patriots possesses certain scenes that had the potential to be some of the greatest of my gameplay career, yet by forcing me to be nothing more than an observer, I literally felt robbed of opportunities I should have taken part in. Rather than having memories of "being there" and "doing that", all I'll remember is that I was bored to death watching too many movies that ran on for too long.

The most baffling thing is that there are countless examples of other games which don't have a fraction of the drama that Kojima is able to create, yet their methods of making players feel a part of the events are far more successful than anything Guns of the Patriots achieves. Even something as simple as a button-pushing quick-time events would have done much to reduce the feeling of the player being completely nonessential. Unbelievably, this commonplace technique was completely ignored throughout the length of the game, until two short sequences at the end. Much too little, much too late.

Some may raise the point that the Metal Gear series has such a convoluted history and had so many loose ends to wrap up that the game needs to go places where gameplay can't follow; certain themes are too abstract or cerebral to translate into a concrete action able to be taken by a player, and I respect that.  However, Guns of the Patriots indulges this side of its identity to unbelievable excess. Quite honestly, Kojima would have been better served by simply making a film and delivering the kind of experience he so obviously wants to, and not letting the problem of integrating gameplay hold him back.

Outdated design aside, I take serious issue with the content presented by Metal Gear Solid 4. The series has always been known as eccentric, but there has ever been a method to its madness—some sense of genius and purpose underneath all the confusing elements and bizarre plot twists. Not so with Guns of the Patriots. Kojima has been quoted in the press countless times as saying that he's tired of working on Metal Gear games, and that message comes through loud and clear.

Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the  Patriots Screenshot

More than anything, I get the sense that there was a focused effort put towards simply ending the series and wrapping up all loose ends, regardless of the quality of the final effort.  Perhaps it was Kojima's way of making sure that he won't be forced to work on another Metal Gear game, but a lot of the nonsensical bits, absurd dialogue, tedious choices and absolutely missed opportunities feel jarringly out of step with what the last three games in this saga have been driving towards.

There was one particular scene at the end of the game that I felt could be a true milestone; a new high water mark in the kind of emotional impact that a videogame could have. The gravitas; the sheer emotional weight onscreen at that moment had intensity beyond words. At that instant, I was prepared to forgive many of the game's sins outright. Sadly, that potential for ultimate greatness was pathetically pissed away, just like so many other things that fail to crystallize over the course of what will likely be Snake's last mission. I have a hard time imagining that the Hideo Kojima of old would have allowed such a catastrophic misstep to happen, yet there it was.

So, where does all this leave Guns of the Patriots? The gameplay (what precious little of it there is) is still stuck in PS2-era levels of sophistication. A huge chunk of the total running time is non-interactive cutscenes, and these long segments of cinema are of questionable quality, filled with plot holes, nonsensical choices and fan service that undercuts its legitimacy. Is this a revolutionary, cutting-edge experience, or unchecked excess and failure to meet the standard of its contemporaries? To me, the answer is obvious.

Believe it or not, I do call myself a fan of Solid Snake, of Metal Gear, and most of all, of Hideo Kojima. These games are without a doubt significant, important titles that will not be forgotten. Kojima himself is absolutely brilliant, often blazing trails that others feared to tread and leading the way for lesser developers to follow in his footsteps.  However, as much as I admire the man and his work, even the greatest of us can tire and falter. Even the greatest of us can make mistakes. I would love to have a chance to sit down with one of the industry's most well-known, well-respected auteurs and find out exactly what significance Guns of the Patriots holds for him because, quite honestly, it's a shadow of what it could, and should have been. Rating: 6.5 out of 10.

Brad Gallaway

Brad Gallaway

Brad Gallaway has been gaming since the days when arcades were everywhere and the Atari 2600 was cutting edge. So, like... A while.

Currently, he's got about 42 minutes a night to play because adulting is a timesuck, but despite that, he's a happily married guy with two kids who both have better K/D ratios than he does.

Brad still loves Transformers, he's on Marvel Puzzle Quest when nobody at the office is looking, and his favorite game of all time is the first Mass Effect -- and he thought the trilogy's ending was Just Fine, Thanks.

Follow Brad on Twitter at @BradGallaway
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99 Comments on "Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots Second Opinion"

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Anonymous
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Anonymous
5 years 25 days ago
I know the MGS storyline so well that I could probably narrate it by memory. Instead of plot holes, its more like there are “patches” over obvious holes that might be there. here are some examples: 1. Big Boss’s Body and Eva’s reaction. Eva said she knew that it wasn’t really Big Boss’ body…why did she risk her precious life? 2. Why try to preserve Big Boss’ body? If liquid gets a hand on it the SOP system will be his. Besides those, here are some “annoyances” rather than “patch-ups”: 1 . Big Boss at the end has a different… Read more »
Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 1 month ago

All reviews are a personal opinion. That’s just a core truth central to all reviews. When you find a review without any personal opinion, please let me know–I’d love to read it.

All right here you go:

http://www.destructoid.com/100-objective-review-final-fantasy-xiii-179178.phtml

I know I’m kind of late to the party…

Anonymous
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Anonymous
6 years 3 months ago

I liked MGS4 a lot more than Brad did, but I know raving defensive fanboys when I see them. This comment thread is full of them. Pretty old comments, though. Maybe some of them have grown up a little by now.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
7 years 8 months ago
This is a little late to comment, but I’ve been out of the gaming loop: “the simple fact is that a videogame is not a film.” I guess that makes two of us who believe that, and I appreciate the honest review from your perspective. Even the severe amount of cut-scenes in MGS2 made me want to pull an Elvis on the television… and since then, I still don’t think an MGS game has matched the “tactical espionage action” feel of even the first Splinter Cell. Additionally, I’ve always been surprised at the low standards gamers have for cut scenes… Read more »
Anonymous
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Anonymous
7 years 8 months ago
[quote=Brad Gallaway]This thread has gone on way longer than i imagined it would, and (mostly) thanks to everybody for participating. just a few final comments, and then you guys are free to take this wherever you want to, i’ve repeated my points over and over again and i need to move on to other things besides defending a technically above-average score for a mediocre game. before anything else, let me just say that in retrospect i would have added a word or two to the review to clarify that i’m not against cutscenes *as a rule* and that their inclusion… Read more »
Stevo
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Stevo
8 years 2 months ago

I would just like to say thanks Brad for taking the time to give responses to the posts on the forum.

I can now see a bit better where you are coming with the review in terms of the 5/10 being average where as average in many other sites/mags starts from 7/10.

Brad Gallaway
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Brad Gallaway
8 years 2 months ago
This thread has gone on way longer than i imagined it would, and (mostly) thanks to everybody for participating. just a few final comments, and then you guys are free to take this wherever you want to, i’ve repeated my points over and over again and i need to move on to other things besides defending a technically above-average score for a mediocre game. before anything else, let me just say that in retrospect i would have added a word or two to the review to clarify that i’m not against cutscenes *as a rule* and that their inclusion in… Read more »
Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago

[quote=Stevo]

Whether Mass Effect should be a 10 or not is a completely different argument but the fact that his own criteria has changed from reviewing one game to another PROVES that his personal opinion is his only croiteria for reviewing rather than informed judgement.[/quote]

I can see your point. That was one of his critiques of the game.

Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Odofakyodo]My point was that someone has to actually be doing something, making decisions, configuring the events that are going on. Dancing requires that. Video games require that. That is all I’m saying. Yes, the specific skills needed to dance are different than the specific skills needed to play a videogame. So what? Both require effort and energy to be expent in order to exist. Just because one activity is more physical than another doesn’t mean the more mental one can’t be great art. Each activity requires it’s own special skills. Not everyone can play a game very well, not everyone… Read more »
Stevo
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Stevo
8 years 2 months ago
Jesus, my Mass effect reference is relevant as Brad stated in his review that MGS4 is what is expected of a game with a ‘next-gen’ overhaul but below the standard of which many other games have acheived so far doing this. And that MGS4 lacks any genuine move forward in innovation. This was a major flaw of MGS per Brad yet with Mass Effect which is a modern version in effect of KOTOR (i.e. its premise and gameplay mechanics remain the same)he basically ignores this point by giving Mass Effect a 10/10. That is a very valid argument as it… Read more »
Eric
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Eric
8 years 2 months ago
Well that’s all well and good, Brad, but you didn’t respond to the issue i raised. you complained in your review that the cut-scenes in Guns of the Patriots were too long and that the cut-scene to gameplay ratio was too skewed to the cut-scenes. i’ll admit that’s a legitimate complaint, but the problem is that the previous games, which you said you were a fan off, also had cut-scenes that were just as long as the ones in MGS4, and also had a ratio that favored the cut-scenes. so what i’m basically asking is this; if you were okay… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
My point was that someone has to actually be doing something, making decisions, configuring the events that are going on. Dancing requires that. Video games require that. That is all I’m saying. Yes, the specific skills needed to dance are different than the specific skills needed to play a videogame. So what? Both require effort and energy to be expent in order to exist. Just because one activity is more physical than another doesn’t mean the more mental one can’t be great art. Each activity requires it’s own special skills. Not everyone can play a game very well, not everyone… Read more »
Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Odofakyodo] What I meant was more general “acting” in the sense of doing something – expending some effort and exerting some control over the situation. As in the case of dancing, some activity has to be going on for the art to exist.[/quote] I’m sorry activity? Video games, expending effort? I’m not trying to be facetious but come on. Comparing the physical dexterity and endurance required in dancing to the movement of fingers on a control seems a bit off. If you want to say you exert some mental energy that’s fine. When i was a kid i used to… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
[quote]Hmm should I? Only b/c its been a long time since we argued Odafakyodo. Are you saying gaming is acting or like acting? If so i would vehemently have to disagree with you.[/quote] That’s not exactly what I meant, but I would say that sometimes, or perhaps often, gaming is like acting (as in, you know, an actor in a movie or a play) because the player is pretending to be her avatar or some fictitious character. It is fundamentally different from acting because the player’s path is not pre-scripted. What I meant was more general “acting” in the sense… Read more »
Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago

I don’t understand why Mass effect’s score is an issue. What does it matter what he thought of mass effect if we’re talking about Metal Gear. Metal gear left much to be desired, the cut scenes took a lot out of the gameplay and the story was so so at best. How are these points invalidated by Mass Effect being rated a 10?

Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago

[quote=Odofakyodo] Occasionally it can be seen and heard (film), so why not seen, heard, and acted, as in the case of videogames?[/quote]

Hmm should I? Only b/c its been a long time since we argued Odafakyodo. Are you saying gaming is acting or like acting? If so i would vehemently have to disagree with you.

CJ Park
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CJ Park
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Stevo]Interestingly Brad slates MGS4 for lack of innovation on gameplay and yet gives Mass Effect a 10/10. Although I personally like this game, it is essentially a glorified package of Knights of the Republic with some updates that are expected with the ‘next-gen’ (as you slated MGS4 for). I think you are a bit contradictory in your beliefs and principals here Brad. [/quote] Wow, he gave mass effect a 10/10? This is the same Brad right? The same Brad that is saying that 5/10 is the REAL average. A 10/10 means that the game is GODLY PERFECT. So GODLY that… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
[quote]This is exactly how I feel about the art concept. Anything can be labelled ‘art’ with its very wide reaching definitions. But games have been and will always be about ‘playing’ and ‘gameplay’.[/quote] [quote]Any ways I need to go as I have some one who has come to view my art collection, being Snakes & Ladders, Monopoly and Halo 3 (LOL).[/quote] While the joke is amusing, the assumption implicit in these statements, and much of the rest of your arguments, is that only things that can be “viewed”–that is, observed visually–and whose primary purpose is not to entertain can be… Read more »
Stevo
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Stevo
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Selfless Pride]I have to agree with Jesus and Stevo. Many debates are rarely black and white. And I have enjoyed reading the arguments about “Art” and “Games”. The problem with “Art” is that it can be used in practically everything. The programming code written to launch a Nasa shuttle into space is just a work of art in the way the alogrithms are condensed and put together. Hard core programmers would “get off” looking at code like that. The point here is when “Games” were first derived, they were meant to be a past-time people can interact and have fun.… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Snack Eater]I think I have a much more developed understanding of what MGS is really about than all of these literal-minded fanboys butthurt over Brad’s review. It’s called Gamecritics, not Gamereviewers. Criticism is the articulation of one’s own personal opinion on a work of art (and/or commercial entertainment, so as not to bait the philistines), that is Brad’s opinion, he’s articulated it nicely, and there’s no reason he has to get in lock step with everybody else, especially since one of the things that videogame criticism needs now is more disparity between reviews to help foster a healthy discussion, which… Read more »
Anonymous
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Anonymous
8 years 2 months ago

Kyle ur gay! Brad=Ownage!

Sorry it had to come to this.

Kyle
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Kyle
8 years 2 months ago
I don’t think that defeats the point that MGO should have been mentionned to some degree as it is part of the game regardless. As consumers should know about it. I’ve just read through all the comments and it’s been fun. From talking about Art to the Review to the Bashing. One thing’s for sure. This is entertaining. 😛 I do think everyone has a point to some degree whether it’s Brad or the flaming from some of the commenters. Underneath all the comments there lies actual good points which should be carefully looked at. Hopefully these will be carried… Read more »
Padan Fain
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Padan Fain
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Nick]Wow, follow your own advice buddy. Waaaaaaaa. What a sap. To answer this screaming lunatic’s reponses: 1. The Ferrari and Rolls Royce analogy Aaron made answers this easily. 2. The database is there for people who didn’t follow all the MGS or for those who want to know more about the MGS universe. They did not provide it to clarify MGS4. If you looked at it (which you obviously didn’t) it contains everything about MGS. 3. A review should cover core aspects of the game. MGO is a BIG part of the game. It might not be part of the… Read more »
Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago
Dude, seriously…calm down. I don’t think anyone on here has said the game is bad. Brad said it could have been better, that’s all. What do YOU expect from this site? If your’re expecting ign, gamsespot, gamepro, bs “Greatest ever!!!” “Perfect 10!” you’ve come to the wrong site. The game is good, you can breathe easy, I’m sure Brad thinks its good too. Seems like you came here with that mentallity from other sites, with classy lines like, “MGS4 OWNS!” and “MGS4>HALO3!”. Take that crap to ign with the rest of the flamers. As far as Metal Gear online goes,… Read more »
Snack Eater
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Snack Eater
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Nick] 4. No one has directly accused Brad of such. We all asked a simple question. What did you expect from MGS4? We all said as a fan, we all know that it will have crazy long cutscenes and codec moments. Over-the-top insane storyline with wierd bosses. To most people who have played past MGS games it is hard to believe that Brad has really played any from what he has said. He is taking off points for something that he should have already known. It’s like saying Oblivion lost points because the world is so open. Or GTA lost… Read more »
Snack Eater
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Snack Eater
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Aaron]I don’t think you should answer for people. And I don’t think you know much about MGS yourself. MGS has alway had almost seemingly “supernatural” stuff about it. Nanomachines is just the best way to describe it instead of short throughing aliens in there or gamma radiation. Heck, look at MGS3 with the Cobra Unit which was before the Nanomachines. What the heck is that? This is MGS for goodness sakes! As MANY readers pointed out, what type of game were you expecting??? You and Brad fail to see what MGS is all about. End of story. You fail to… Read more »
Nick
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Nick
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Padan Fain]Wow. Some of you are taking this review way too personally. Looks like Brad hit a nerve. 1) Just because someone is a “fan” of something doesn’t mean that he has to see everything the way you do. It doesn’t mean he has to forgive things that he sees as excessive even they “OMFGorz they are MGS, for pete’s sake, what did you expect you n00b?? Waaa gimme my bottle I’m gonna cry now!” 2) If you have to read a freaking database to understand a the narrative, then the cutscenes must not have done a very good job… Read more »
Brad Gallaway
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Brad Gallaway
8 years 2 months ago
First of all, i think it’s hilariously absurd that the comment was made that a guy who uses the handle ‘Snack Eater’ doesn’t know what MGS is about. Secondly… [quote]but if he was really a fan of the previous games, he should have at least enjoyed playing through it. simply because MGS4 has everything that made the previous games fantastic, and then some.[/quote] So let me get this straight– if i was a fan of the previous games (which i was, and still am) then i should have at least enjoyed playing through MGS4. besides the fact that i generally… Read more »
Padan Fain
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Padan Fain
8 years 2 months ago
Wow. Some of you are taking this review way too personally. Looks like Brad hit a nerve. 1) Just because someone is a “fan” of something doesn’t mean that he has to see everything the way you do. It doesn’t mean he has to forgive things that he sees as excessive even they “OMFGorz they are MGS, for pete’s sake, what did you expect you n00b?? Waaa gimme my bottle I’m gonna cry now!” 2) If you have to read a freaking database to understand a the narrative, then the cutscenes must not have done a very good job at… Read more »
Nick
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Nick
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Eric]Of course Brad is free to dislike any game he wants, for any reason he sees fit. The problem is that he claims to be a ‘fan’ of the Metal Gear series, but criticizes Guns of the Patriots for things that other fans love about the series, and what we feel make the series great. i would just like to ask Brad what exactly he was a fan of in regard to the past games; they had all the ‘issues’ he complained about in this review, such as the long cut-scenes. like i eluted too in my previous comment; Brad… Read more »
Nick
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Nick
8 years 2 months ago
Oh and seriously, a serious reviewer or critic should take ALL aspects of the game into account. How can you leave out such a big component of the game? The COMPLETE LACK of not mentionning Metal Gear Online in the review is a huge blind sight on the reviewer’s part. A simple note would have even helped. In the mission statement, the VERY FIRST point says: Provide consumers with insightful, useful, and entertaining content on videogames. If I was just an average consumer knowing nothing about MGS4, then I would no nothing about MGO after reading this review. You have… Read more »
Nick
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Nick
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=jesus]Sounds like a lot of you wanted a review like the ones gamespot and ign gave. Brad said that on this site the average is 5 out of 10 not 8 out of 10 like most sites. The cut scenes are remarkable, but Brad’s right, I want to play the game not watch it. If Kojima wanted me to watch, he could have made it a movie ala Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children. The game scored a 6.5 which within the context of THIS site is good, not great. I’m not finished (on Act IV) but thus far I have… Read more »
Eric
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Eric
8 years 2 months ago
Of course Brad is free to dislike any game he wants, for any reason he sees fit. The problem is that he claims to be a ‘fan’ of the Metal Gear series, but criticizes Guns of the Patriots for things that other fans love about the series, and what we feel make the series great. i would just like to ask Brad what exactly he was a fan of in regard to the past games; they had all the ‘issues’ he complained about in this review, such as the long cut-scenes. like i eluted too in my previous comment; Brad… Read more »
jesus
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jesus
8 years 2 months ago
Sounds like a lot of you wanted a review like the ones gamespot and ign gave. Brad said that on this site the average is 5 out of 10 not 8 out of 10 like most sites. The cut scenes are remarkable, but Brad’s right, I want to play the game not watch it. If Kojima wanted me to watch, he could have made it a movie ala Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children. The game scored a 6.5 which within the context of THIS site is good, not great. I’m not finished (on Act IV) but thus far I have… Read more »
Aaron
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Aaron
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Snack Eater][quote=Selfless Pride]That is why you shouldn’t review this game. You could care less about the story. Don’t bother replying because it will get no where. Most people have already disagreed with you. I’m sure you are the type who aims at trying to aim for the minority to hopefully become that majority one day. Anyway, keep trying. No point debating on this as you don’t care about the story obviously. It was well done if you understood it all and as another reader pointed it, listed out many emotional moments.[/quote] I think Brad cares very deeply about the Metal… Read more »
Snack Eater
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Snack Eater
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Selfless Pride]That is why you shouldn’t review this game. You could care less about the story. Don’t bother replying because it will get no where. Most people have already disagreed with you. I’m sure you are the type who aims at trying to aim for the minority to hopefully become that majority one day. Anyway, keep trying. No point debating on this as you don’t care about the story obviously. It was well done if you understood it all and as another reader pointed it, listed out many emotional moments.[/quote] I think Brad cares very deeply about the Metal Gear… Read more »
CJ Park
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CJ Park
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Eric]Okay, Brad, you are officially my least favorite critic on this site. people like you are the reason why many people accuse critics of being cynical assholes. [/quote] Haha. I wouldn’t go that far to call them assholes. That’s too harsh. Brad reviewed it the way he thought. But obviously he failed on many aspects. Simple as that. [quote=Eric] you claim to be a fan of the series, but based on what you criticized the game for, i can’t believe you. especally in regards to the cut-scenes; the cut-scenes in Guns of the Patriots are no different than the ones… Read more »
Selfless Pride
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Selfless Pride
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Brad Gallaway] i’m not confused at all, i simply think that MGS3 ended on a fantastically high note in terms of what Kojima achieved, and all MGS4 did was to bring down and sully what he created. if you’re a “fan” and all you care about is X answer to Y question, then of course you’d want “the end of the series” and read the MGS database from start to finish. in terms of writing, craft, and emotional impact, MGS4 is pretty laughable and a low point for Kojima as far as i’m concerned. i would have much preferred he… Read more »
Eric
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Eric
8 years 2 months ago
Okay, Brad, you are officially my least favorite critic on this site. people like you are the reason why many people accuse critics of being cynical assholes. you claim to be a fan of the series, but based on what you criticized the game for, i can’t believe you. especally in regards to the cut-scenes; the cut-scenes in Guns of the Patriots are no different than the ones in previous games. they’re just as long and plentiful. in fact, after i first played through MGS4, i played through Sons of Liberty (that’d be MGS2) again, and the cut-scenes in THAT… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
Jesus, I am not speaking of videogames as art out of context. I have not removed them from society or culture. I am simply starting from a fundamental definition and building on that. I believe that we need to recognize what “art” is and what a “game” is and what exactly is the relationship, if any, between the two. We can use societal and cultural observations to do that. Actually, I think we are in large part in agreement. We both think that art has a broad scope. We both think that videogames are art. And I totally agree with… Read more »
Brad Gallaway
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Brad Gallaway
8 years 2 months ago
[quote]Completely agree. I think Brad has Snake from MGS3 and Solid Snake from MG1/MG2/MGS1/MGS2/MGS4 confused. At least that’s how it sounds. Ending at MGS3 would leave too many questions unanswered in the series. Especially when they ended with such a climax at the end of MGS2 by revealing The Patriots.[/quote] i’m not confused at all, i simply think that MGS3 ended on a fantastically high note in terms of what Kojima achieved, and all MGS4 did was to bring down and sully what he created. if you’re a “fan” and all you care about is X answer to Y question,… Read more »
Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Brad Gallaway] since game reviews at GC don’t start at 8 = average, a lower than expected score was the only outcome. the concept of “art” wasn’t really used to knock points off, unless you ant to talk about the terrible writing or horrible directorial choices. = )[/quote] HAHAHA!! Not done with the game yet, but so true. I see your point on the losing of immersion from the game. Once Kojima makes you pay attention to the cut scenes instead of having you involved in the game, you realize two things: Man the cut scences look great, and man… Read more »
Brad Gallaway
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Brad Gallaway
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Selfless Pride] When people look at video game reviews, the majority want to know how the game plays, is it worth playing, are the graphics good, then comes is the story good? I think the problems lies within this site, I’m sorry. This site GameCritics.com should really have a mission statement or something indicating that our reviews are more heavily based on how games have progressed to become an art form. If that’s the case, then 6.5 go ahead and no one would argue as much. [/quote] Hey S.P. Thanks for your comments, and i definitely see your point. it… Read more »
Selfless Pride
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Selfless Pride
8 years 2 months ago

Oops forgot to add something.

Brad I would like to know those “plot holes” that you mentionned as well. You said “full of plot holes”.

Shoot them at me, I’m quite sure I can answer them as long it is reasonable. Not something like, “How is it possible to keep Big Boss alive?”

As one of the commenters said earlier, it isn’t full of plot holes. If it is, it is your lack of understanding of the actual plot and story.

Selfless Pride
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Selfless Pride
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Anonymous] You say that ending the series with MGS3 would have been perfect. Are you completely nuts?!?! This is the proof that you shouldn’t be reviewing it as a “fan”. Instead you should be reviewing this as a regular gamer who enjoys MGS. As a fan, meaning you enjoy the game more then a person who just likes it per say, you would know about the storylines in MG/MGS. If you do know the storyline then how on earth could the ending of MGS3 end the series? MGS3 talked about who Big Boss was and how he came to be.… Read more »
Selfless Pride
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Selfless Pride
8 years 2 months ago
I have to agree with Jesus and Stevo. Many debates are rarely black and white. And I have enjoyed reading the arguments about “Art” and “Games”. The problem with “Art” is that it can be used in practically everything. The programming code written to launch a Nasa shuttle into space is just a work of art in the way the alogrithms are condensed and put together. Hard core programmers would “get off” looking at code like that. The point here is when “Games” were first derived, they were meant to be a past-time people can interact and have fun. That’s… Read more »
jesus
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jesus
8 years 2 months ago
That’s an excellent definition. However, when dealing with society and culture, we must put any defnition describing a cultural or societal phenomena within an appropriate context. By this definition pornography is as much art as shakespeare, not that i disagree, but i think we can see a sharp difference between the two types of art. One is a purely, self-gratifying medium that speaks only to the senses, while the other though gratifying transmits a myriad of emotions, expressions, and observations of the world in which it exists. We must add context folks, the world does not exist within webster’s black… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
I admit that I may have misinterpreted your overall thesis, and I accept that you do consider videogames as art. The place that we differ on, though, is the relative importance of the “artistic” qualities of videogames. I believe they are of paramount importance, while you do not. I accept the fact that I am in the minority in my view. That does not prove me wrong. In fact, I’ve alluded to the need to convince more people of hopping the fence to my side, as the saying goes. Chi also mentioned this need in his article, and I referred… Read more »
Stevo
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Stevo
8 years 2 months ago
As Jesus said earlier on, by judging games as art we are going out of context. This is how I feel and where my argument is based. If you feel that the art side of games is the most important part of a game then congrats to you, because I and virtually every other gamer out there does not. You have missed my point a little trying to get me to justify why games are not art, because I am not stating that. As Jesus said, juding them as art primary is judging them out of context. Of course anything… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Stevo]Odofakyodo, you are really boring me with your ‘art’ definitions and what be. It seems like you would rather talk about art rather than video games my friend?[/quote] Wow. Just Wow. Did you even read what I wrote in my last response to you? Do you even understand what it is we are arguing about here? I explained exactly why I thought it was important for games to be considered art. [quote]Maybe you are a frustrated painter and therfore in the wrong site? I have not met your detailed arguments about what is art, and art can be enjoying blah… Read more »
Chi Kong Lui
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Chi Kong Lui
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Stevo]DO YOU NOT AGREE THAT ART IS A VERY SMALL PROPORTION OF THE OVERALL EXPERIENCE OF A GAME?[/quote] Art is the very experience of the game. Entertainment is one aspect of the art. Analyzing the art of a game is to breakdown the whole experience and not just whether it is fun or not. If you think that Kojima is simply trying to entertain you and nothing else, than you’ve completely missed out on why so many people consider his work genius. There are many other ways to look at the games we play that can be enriching to us.… Read more »
Stevo
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Stevo
8 years 2 months ago
Odofakyodo, you are really boring me with your ‘art’ definitions and what be. It seems like you would rather talk about art rather than video games my friend? Maybe you are a frustrated painter and therfore in the wrong site? I have not met your detailed arguments about what is art, and art can be enjoying blah blah blah because as I said you are going in the wrong direction with this. You can simply mince your words with the art arguments to make everything sound contradictionary by going off point and using all sort of examples. To summarise, games… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
My intent was not to make the argument that because one form is composed of another it must be art (although I think that is not a terrible line of reasoning, it is not one which I wish to pursue at the present time). My intent is to get a definition of art, “objective” or otherwise. And yes, people have come up with definitions of art that are successful. I don’t care if it’s from the dictionary or elsewhere, but there must be some definition of art that you accept in order to label something as art or not. You… Read more »
Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Odofakyodo]A challenge, then! 😀 Give me a definition of art that encompasses drawing, painting, and sculpture (or whatever you would consider art) that does not apply to architecture. I believe this would clarify much.[/quote] Are you saying that b/c Architecture involves drawing, painting, and sculpture this means it is art? I really hope you’re not making such a simplistic argument. Guitar hero has music, an instrument, and requires skill to perform well. So by your simplistic (not to be offensive, just pointing out a major flaw) reasoning b/c i play guitar hero i am a musician? Please tell me i… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago

A challenge, then! 😀 Give me a definition of art that encompasses drawing, painting, and sculpture (or whatever you would consider art) that does not apply to architecture. I believe this would clarify much.

Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago

Lets add a bit of context to this argument, an architect can build the most beautiful building in the world. We would not call the building art, we would call it a fine work of architecture. Video games can be impressive and breathtaking in their own way, but when trying to judge games as art we may be going outside of the proper context.

Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Stevo]”Most books are purchased for entertainment, and therefore are not art” and “Most movies are for purchased for entertainment” Well done you are correct I am saying that movies and books are not art. You have hit it on the nail, they are both for enetrtainment or to kill time.[/quote] Most people would disagree with you here, and that doesn’t even include the many people who make professional livings breaking down the artistic elements in movies and books. Furthermore, you conveniently ignored my statement, “Most paintings are purchased for entertainment, and therefore are not art,” which is the logical conclusion… Read more »
Stevo
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Stevo
8 years 2 months ago
Just to clarify, I may of said that games are not art, but this does not mean that I don’t appreciate that there are many artistic attributes to them. I am just saying that as a whole a game is an entertainment product and the art part is just a small proportion of what makes it what it is. Of course ‘art’ entertains in some form but you are going off in the wrong direction with this. No one wants a definition of art as we are all capable of picking up a dictionary. Art is art and games are… Read more »
Stevo
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Stevo
8 years 2 months ago
Odofakyodo says: “Most books are purchased for entertainment, and therefore are not art” and “Most movies are for purchased for entertainment” Well done you are correct I am saying that movies and books are not art. You have hit it on the nail, they are both for enetrtainment or to kill time. Anyway, forgetting the ‘art’ or not art argument, my main point is that even if they contain many artistic attributes they are bought for entertainment, full stop. Don’t start comparing them against books or movies to prove your point because art has very wide criteria and can be… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
Stevo, your argument is just plain flawed. You are saying “Most games are purchased for entertainment, so therefore they are not art”. By that same logic, you would have to claim “Most books are purchased for entertainment, and therefore are not art” and “Most movies are for purchased for entertainment, and therefore are not art.” Hell, I could even say “Most paintings are purchased for entertainment, and therefore are not art” because let’s face it, people enjoy looking at paintings and appreciate them for the visual form and beauty, giving them pleasure–and that is entertainment. So, you have failed to… Read more »
Stevo
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Stevo
8 years 2 months ago
I’m not saying they have no art representations at all, all I am pointing out is that they are a form of past-time and entertainment before all else. 99% of why games are bought are to play and not admire. This is the very soul of what ‘games’ are and this will never be changed unless computer generated content is used for art only then this will eb a seperate concept, but as long as we are ‘playing’ them on consoles etc they will always be games and therefore always be entertainment. It is not short sighted, as I said… Read more »
Brad Gallaway
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Brad Gallaway
8 years 2 months ago

the same thing has been said about every form of media humanity’s ever created, yet it hasn’t stopped people’s creativity and ideas from being expressed in ways that are later considered with greater respect than they were at the outset.

Are games art now? i’d say yes, but in a very early, formative stage. it’s literally happening before our eyes.

will they be widely considered as art later? undoubtedly. any other attitude is just shortsighted and ignorant of the patterns repeated over and over throughout history.

Stevo
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Stevo
8 years 2 months ago
Can I just make my point on this subject. A few of you have referred to games as ‘art’. This is a load of utter bull****. Yes games can be very artistic in nature but to consider them art is taking your self to serious. Entertainment over powers any ideals of art ten fold with games. I don’t subscribe to the idea that many gamers play games to admire it as ‘art’. Games are interactive in nature so are different to all other mediums. Nearly every gamer buys and plays a game for sheer enjoyment and ‘entertainment’ not to add… Read more »
Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago
Chi’s right i am being closed minded on the subject of its futre developement. The film comparison is a bit off though. Motion pictures began exclusively as a new form of visual art, akin to photography. Later we saw the advent of newsreels and during the spanish-american war, there were shots of maritime battle that were actually staged in a tub. Soon afterwards it evolved to the point of containing narrative stories. But i digress, videogames may in fact have the a simlar impact artisically. Only later in its developement did film become synonymous with mass entertainement, unlike videogames. Again,… Read more »
Chi Kong Lui
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Chi Kong Lui
8 years 2 months ago

Jesus is talking about how games currently are and Odofakyodo is talking about the potential of medium of videogames.

Jesus doesn’t believe that games can elevate themselves, but if everyone thought like that, we’d all be watching 3-D movies and jumping out of chairs and there would be no Citizen Kane and Godfather.

Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
FYI: This is a good discussion. By saying “User generated material is as much art as tracing a picture or using pre-fabricated stencils to make drawings,” I think you are drastically shortchanging the potential of the medium. In terms of both complexity and how many choices the user has at his disposal, there is very little comparison between, say, a city built in SimCity and a stencil drawing. The former has been constructed based on a vast array of parameters and decisions and the structures of the results can give fairly deep insights into the person who played the game.… Read more »
Aoki
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Aoki
8 years 2 months ago

I’ll admit my post was fairly vague and you were right to call me out.

Plot holes was the wrong word. How about farfetched or ridiculous? But that’s a matter of taste. I doubt a database will change that.

Stevo
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Stevo
8 years 2 months ago
Thanks Brad for your reasoning. I am thankful for you offering very analytical and detailed reasoning to your review and that is why people like me come onto this site for. I still feel though that technical and supported arguments aside that games need to be judged on the overall package and experience and not dismantled and dissectted into pieces, which is how I feel the negative criticism of this game comes across. Personally I think 6.5 is a low score as although MGS4 may not be perfect it offers more and has a lot more going for itself than… Read more »
jesus
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jesus
8 years 2 months ago
I am not offended, although i must point out that you are proving my point [quote],to a certain extent I do think it’s valid to judge them by the same criteria as many other media because, as you suggested earlier, video games use film, text, sound etc as tools. But these tools are a means to an end – they are a way to convey information about the true strength of video games, what people commonly refer to as “interactivity”. [/quote] The true strength of video games is interactivity, not art. User generated material is as much art as tracing… Read more »
Selfless Pride
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Selfless Pride
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Aoki]A game with cinematic allusions…but full of plot holes and bad dialogue. Marketed as next-gen…but an archaic game design premise. Bizarre, confusing, esoteric…but that’s ok cos he’s an auteur? Many contradictions in the MGS universe and it was good of you to raise them, Brad. Kojima appreciation has almost become a badge of honour among game journalists. I’m glad someone finally has the guts to point out that he’s good but not that good.[/quote] First off, the game is not full of plot holes. If you feel it is, it is because you gave up trying to understand it. The… Read more »
pu
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pu
8 years 2 months ago

[quote=deeptroath]you are really an asshole dude.[/quote]

and you are really a “figlio di puttana sucaminchie impalato bastardo con quella zoccola di tua madre succhiacazzi incuneata di una madonna stronza malata di cancro al culo” DUDE

now go to translate this… pezzo di merda…

thanks mr deepthroath,,,, do you call deeptroath because you like dix?

Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
As a departure point for this LONG reply (I apologize, I got on a roll), it is encouraging to me to hear you say that gameplay is the most important element when judging a game. I think with any piece of art we need to judge it on its own terms. When you say “if i’m judging it as i would a film”, then it doesn’t meet your expectations of great art, my response is “Why would it?” You are judging it by the criteria that you judge a film, when it is not a film. It is a game.… Read more »
Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Odofakyodo]To say that video games as a whole will never be as sophisticated as other art forms seems quite a monstrous assumption, given that 1) They could be around for thousands of years, if not forever; and 2) There are already popular video games out there that contain deep and complex use of gameplay. Chi mentioned several in his article. There are many others. Sim City, for example, has quite a deep and elegant rule set that allows the user to build complex creations, each of which can have its own unique personality. For all their faults, even MGS games… Read more »
Anonymous
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Anonymous
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Brad Gallaway]Hi everyone, thanks for your comments. and finally, i would just like to again state that i actually am a fan of both Kojima and the series, it’s just that MGS4 whiffed on so many levels that it’s hard for me to really take it seriously. IMO, ending the series with Snake Eater would have been perfect… the emotion and gravity of Snake at the end when he realizes what he’s done to the Boss and what’s been done to him is a powerful, emotional high point in characterization and direction. the only scene that comes even close in… Read more »
Stephen Burkett
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Stephen Burkett
8 years 2 months ago
This is what I love about reading reviews on this site and the comments subsequently; there are a lot of reasoned arguments going on that almost always make me think about elements of the game experience in a way I hadn’t before. While I often find the reviews to be on the pessimistic side, I don’t know if I can say I’ve ever read a point raised that didn’t have merit, they’re usually just something I didn’t see as a big problem myself. Indeed there seems to always be someone saying to stop taking videogames so seriously and just enjoy… Read more »
Aoki
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Aoki
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Stevo] if you are going to mock a game for its chosen genre then why play that game in the first place? If you don’t like cut scenes and cinematic games then you shouldn’t even play this game as you are slating the game for its own boundaries it has created, not because of lack of innovation but because of the developers choice. [/quote] Steve, there’s a point Brad alludes to, and I agree with it, that the game’s cinematics fall short even within the boundaries it set for itself. While technically impressive, there are too many ham-fisted moments to… Read more »
Brad Gallaway
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Brad Gallaway
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Stevo] Games are for entertainment, if you are going to mock a game for its chosen genre then why play that game in the first place?[/quote] The problem here is that your premise is the wrong one. i don’t think David or myself would be comfortable working from a position believing solely that “games are for entertainment.” it’s true that entertainment is a large part of it, but like any other art form or medium, they can be more than simple pastimes or sources of gratification. Kojima himself has done more than most to prove this concept, which is a… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
If I get this straight, Jesus, your argument is this: Video games will never be as sophisticated as other art forms because they appeal primarily to self-gratification. I agree with you that video games are generally not as sophisticated as other art forms. You may even be correct as to your reason. However, even if that is true, you have provided no evidence to support the claim that this will always be the case. Other art forms–drawing, painting, writing, etc–have existed for thousands of years of human history. In constrast, video games have only been around for about 50 years… Read more »
Jesus
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Jesus
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Chi Kong Lui]. This is just not true. I wrote an article for teens, “Are Videogames Art?” dated in 2003, that compared great works of art to videogames.[/quote] I read your article its very intersting, I’m not saying video games are incapable of being works of art, I said as an artistic medium it lacks the sophistication of other types of art. In your comparison, where is the video game Guernica, where is the Anna Karerina? Simply put, there are no video game equivalents. [quote=Chi Kong Lui]So you don’t watch movies to be gratified? All forms of art provide some… Read more »
Stevo
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Stevo
8 years 2 months ago
Odofakyodo says… (Quote) The point Brad was making about MGS4 is that not only does it lack innovation, in several respects it doesn’t even catch up with current-gen games, and he provided multiple examples of this. Personally, I saw a similar pattern with previous MGS games. Games are for entertainment, if you are going to mock a game for its chosen genre then why play that game in the first place? If you don’t like cut scenes and cinematic games then you shouldn’t even play this game as you are slating the game for its own boundaries it has created,… Read more »
ShaCaska
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ShaCaska
8 years 2 months ago

Simple statement: isn’t Hideo Kojima a fan of irony?

(Hint – Ending)

deeptroath
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deeptroath
8 years 2 months ago

you are really an asshole dude.

PU
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PU
8 years 2 months ago
funny to see these critics… I don’t play mgs4 yet, but i can say that IT IS NOT ANOTHER FPS games… time ago fps where only on pc (and in majority, believe me or not, for the usa market) then if you want to go around and waste your time with all these game (they are all the same thing) nobody tell you nothing… it’s a shame to read all these critics on to this game… lot of people is happy to see ALL THESE FANTASTIC GAMES coming out (FPS) … i’m not… games like mgs4 are good games… could… Read more »
Aoki
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Aoki
8 years 2 months ago

A game with cinematic allusions…but full of plot holes and bad dialogue.

Marketed as next-gen…but an archaic game design premise.

Bizarre, confusing, esoteric…but that’s ok cos he’s an auteur?

Many contradictions in the MGS universe and it was good of you to raise them, Brad.

Kojima appreciation has almost become a badge of honour among game journalists. I’m glad someone finally has the guts to point out that he’s good but not that good.

Chi Kong Lui
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Chi Kong Lui
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=jesus]I’m relatively new to this site. I’ve only read the reviews of a couple of games, GTA IV and Metal Gear. While the critiques put forth by the writers are fantastic and incredibly well thought out, ultimately we are talking about video games. As an artistic medium, video games lack the sophistication of film, literature, and fine art. Which seems like a paradox considering that it is comprised of all those elements. Ultimately, video games are comprised of images and sensory elements that form a reified “experience” of something.[/quote] This is just not true. I wrote an article for teens,… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=stevo]6.5 for this game is a joke. Okay, it could have the worst gameplay and lack of innovation ever, but just based on it’s graphics and sound alone it starts with a 7. If it was only about innovation and new gameplay structures all the time then we would see very simple very low budget games getting 10/10 across the board.[/quote] Logically, doesn’t this mean that everything else in a game – design, gameplay, ai, controls and ui, etc – make up only 30% of what the score should be based on? That seems a bit skewed to me. Shouldn’t… Read more »
jesus
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jesus
8 years 2 months ago
I’m relatively new to this site. I’ve only read the reviews of a couple of games, GTA IV and Metal Gear. While the critiques put forth by the writers are fantastic and incredibly well thought out, ultimately we are talking about video games. As an artistic medium, video games lack the sophistication of film, literature, and fine art. Which seems like a paradox considering that it is comprised of all those elements. Ultimately, video games are comprised of images and sensory elements that form a reified “experience” of something. At least for me, playing video games is about achieving a… Read more »
Brad Gallaway
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Brad Gallaway
8 years 2 months ago

[quote=stevo]it could have the worst gameplay and lack of innovation ever, but just based on it’s graphics and sound alone it starts with a 7. If it was only about innovation and new gameplay structures all the time then we would see very simple very low budget games getting 10/10 across the board.[/quote]

you must not have any real idea of what site you’re at, or what my preferences are a reviewer.

BTW, if you have some of those low-budget games with innovation and new gameplay structures handy, please send them my way.

stevo
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stevo
8 years 2 months ago
6.5 for this game is a joke. Okay, it could have the worst gameplay and lack of innovation ever, but just based on it’s graphics and sound alone it starts with a 7. If it was only about innovation and new gameplay structures all the time then we would see very simple very low budget games getting 10/10 across the board. Face it, we all love good graphics, sound and production, on this level this game is a leader and a bench mark for cinematic experiences in games. It is like a summer blockbuster, no one is going to hail… Read more »
Brad Gallaway
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Brad Gallaway
8 years 2 months ago
Hi everyone, thanks for your comments. i’m not going to say too much, but i would like to clarify a few things. 1> when i wrote about the level of interactivity, Odofakyodo had it right in saying that i was talking about Snake’s immediate surroundings– it wasn’t some sort of complaint that i couldn’t walk into the horizon or somesuch. i’m not knocking the game because it’s not a sandbox like GTA… it just seems to me that in a “tactical espionage action” game, Snake should be able to climb over *all* boxes in the room, not just the ones… Read more »
Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
[quote]This can be put down purely to how long you play the game, but for me, and general play-times I’ve seen going around, the average gametime is roughly 20 hours. That’s 7 hours cut-scenes and 13 hours of gameplay, which pretty much says the exact opposite to what you just said. Again, I’m not trying to gloss over some potential issues MGS4 has; I’ll agree that some more interactive elements would have been nice (even some VR Missions would have sufficed), but otherwise MGS4 offers enough gameplay to keep it from being an actual film, or even a hybrid of… Read more »
MidnightMarauder
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MidnightMarauder
8 years 2 months ago
Ok Brad I know you like to rag on games a lot, and sometimes I agree with you, but some of your complaints about Metal Gear are foolish. I could name any game in every genre and say, Why can’t I go there? Even the biggest games have boundaries. I can go to the edge of the map on Oblivion and see everthying just past me but for some reason I can’t go there. Not to mention the biggest point this is a linear game if you don’t like linear games, why are you chosen to give the second opinion?… Read more »
Crofto
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Crofto
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Odofakyodo]Please correct me if I am wrong, but if I read your Halo analogy correctly, you are talking about a “backdrop” or “skybox”. Skyboxes always appear very far away from the playfield, so there is no ambiguity about whether or not they can be interacted with.[/quote] I’ll admit, it wasn’t exactly a superb example, but it was the first one I could think of. Basically, what I was trying to say is that you could say something like “the doors don’t blow off via rocket fire” to dozens of other linear games, so it seems unfair to direct that as… Read more »
Snack Eater
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Snack Eater
8 years 2 months ago
[quote=Anonymous]I watched “Escape From New York” last night, as it was on TV. I had never seen it before, but I remembered reading somewhere that Kojima got inspiration for the character Snake from this film. (A terrible movie, by the way)[/quote] No, it’s not a terrible movie. It’s a pretty good movie. It’s part of John Carpenter’s early awesome streak. Yeah, it’s kind of joyless and dated, but it’s still well made and Kurt Russell is great in it. Plus any movie that has pre-Scientology Isaac Hayes playing a guy named The Duke automatically has class. [quote=Anonymous]Boy, was I surprised… Read more »
Anonymous
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Anonymous
8 years 2 months ago

Lost Planet: 8.5
MGS 4: 6.5
spooky…..

Odofakyodo
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Odofakyodo
8 years 2 months ago
Crofto, I agree with your point about game objects that are outside of play area simply being there for immersion. However, the way the game space is designed needs to leave little ambiguity about what can be interacted with and what not. Please correct me if I am wrong, but if I read your Halo analogy correctly, you are talking about a “backdrop” or “skybox”. Skyboxes always appear very far away from the playfield, so there is no ambiguity about whether or not they can be interacted with. On the other hand, it sounds like Brad is talking about actual… Read more »
Anonymous
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Anonymous
8 years 2 months ago
I watched “Escape From New York” last night, as it was on TV. I had never seen it before, but I remembered reading somewhere that Kojima got inspiration for the character Snake from this film. (A terrible movie, by the way) Boy, was I surprised at what I saw. For the next hour, I witnessed “Metal Gear: The Movie.” The main character’s name in the movie is actually Snake! He wears an eye-patch, the gun looks like it came from the metal gear universe, and all the talk of corporations and war fit in perfectly with Kojima’s vision. If the… Read more »
Crofto
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Crofto
8 years 2 months ago
While I think MGS4 is a superb game on pretty much every level, I’m not going to argue with your criticisms of the game because most are valid to some degree, though mainly subjective. However I do think the following comment needs addressing: With the amount of horsepower under the PS3’s hood, why can’t Solid Snake walk up mildly sloping hills and interact with his environment outside of specifically prescribed actions? Saying that is like playing Halo, looking at the mountains in the backdrop of a level, and then saying “Why can’t I go there?”. The things you see around… Read more »
Joeenuk
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Joeenuk
8 years 2 months ago

“For example, Solid Snake is still constrained by artificial barriers that many other games of the current age have left behind.”

It seems that Japanese game developers just have different ideas about game design. Perhaps the threshold of one’s suspension of disbelief is culturally determined?

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